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| Simon Cowell: ‘I have thought about cloning my dogs, actually’ | Simon Cowell: ‘I have thought about cloning my dogs, actually’ |
| (35 minutes later) | |
| Keep Your Dog Alive is the talk of this year’s MIPCOM television industry conference in Cannes. It’s a game-show format that would make even Alan Partridge blush: six dog owners competing for the grand prize of having their pet cloned before it dies. | Keep Your Dog Alive is the talk of this year’s MIPCOM television industry conference in Cannes. It’s a game-show format that would make even Alan Partridge blush: six dog owners competing for the grand prize of having their pet cloned before it dies. |
| Simon Cowell is wrapping up a roundtable interview with TV industry journalists when the show – not one of his – comes up in conversation. | |
| “I have thought about cloning my dogs, actually,” he quips, before suggesting that while people would certainly talk about a dog-cloning show, that’s no guarantee that they’d actually watch it. | |
| No suspiciously-identical troupes of dancing dogs on Britain’s Got Talent in the near future, then. But another big theme of MIPCOM is much more relevant to Cowell and his Syco Entertainment production business: shifting viewing habits among young “millennials”. | No suspiciously-identical troupes of dancing dogs on Britain’s Got Talent in the near future, then. But another big theme of MIPCOM is much more relevant to Cowell and his Syco Entertainment production business: shifting viewing habits among young “millennials”. |
| The buzz: they’re watching YouTube videos by the bucketload on a range of devices, and creating their own stars – YouTubers from PewDiePie to Zoella – rather than relying on talent-show judging panels to do it for them. It could be seen as a threat to the kind of TV that Syco and its boss are most identified with | The buzz: they’re watching YouTube videos by the bucketload on a range of devices, and creating their own stars – YouTubers from PewDiePie to Zoella – rather than relying on talent-show judging panels to do it for them. It could be seen as a threat to the kind of TV that Syco and its boss are most identified with |
| Actually, Cowell has dipped his toes in the YouTube waters already. In March 2013 Syco launched You Generation, a “global talent competition” on YouTube that would run for a year, with people uploading auditions showing off their talents. Since that year was up, it has been shelved. | Actually, Cowell has dipped his toes in the YouTube waters already. In March 2013 Syco launched You Generation, a “global talent competition” on YouTube that would run for a year, with people uploading auditions showing off their talents. Since that year was up, it has been shelved. |
| What did Cowell learn from the experiment? “Nothing much. It made a bit of money, I found it time-consuming, and it was mainly that,” he says. “If it was going to carry on, I was going to have to hire 10 or 20 more people… So we put a hold on it.” | What did Cowell learn from the experiment? “Nothing much. It made a bit of money, I found it time-consuming, and it was mainly that,” he says. “If it was going to carry on, I was going to have to hire 10 or 20 more people… So we put a hold on it.” |
| It could be seen as a lost opportunity: You Generation could have been Syco’s way to stealthily become a YouTube multi-channel network (MCN) signing up hundreds of new faces, building up a network to cross-promote them, and perhaps finding the new Bethany Mota or PewDiePie, rather than the next Leona Lewis or Diversity. | It could be seen as a lost opportunity: You Generation could have been Syco’s way to stealthily become a YouTube multi-channel network (MCN) signing up hundreds of new faces, building up a network to cross-promote them, and perhaps finding the new Bethany Mota or PewDiePie, rather than the next Leona Lewis or Diversity. |
| This, I suspect, is why Cowell hasn’t given up on YouTube. “When I’m going to do this, I’m going to do this properly,” he says. “Everything’s happening so quickly at the moment… There are certain things I’m looking at which are of interest to us. You Generation? I personally had nothing to do with it, but this one I saw, I would love to do that.” | This, I suspect, is why Cowell hasn’t given up on YouTube. “When I’m going to do this, I’m going to do this properly,” he says. “Everything’s happening so quickly at the moment… There are certain things I’m looking at which are of interest to us. You Generation? I personally had nothing to do with it, but this one I saw, I would love to do that.” |
| For a growing number of young people, YouTube is their TV, and the stars they find there are as influential to them as celebrities from the music, TV and film worlds – Variety published a much-talked-about survey suggesting this in August, for example. | For a growing number of young people, YouTube is their TV, and the stars they find there are as influential to them as celebrities from the music, TV and film worlds – Variety published a much-talked-about survey suggesting this in August, for example. |
| Is there potential for more crossover between these two worlds? Mota is appearing on Dancing With The Stars – the US version of Strictly Come Dancing – for example. Will we see more YouTubers popping up in TV talent shows? | Is there potential for more crossover between these two worlds? Mota is appearing on Dancing With The Stars – the US version of Strictly Come Dancing – for example. Will we see more YouTubers popping up in TV talent shows? |
| “For a lot of people, they would maybe get nervous if they’ve got a YouTube following. Going on a show like ours can work for you or against you. If you’re good, it’s going to benefit you. If you’re not, to be honest, you might as well stay on YouTube,” says Cowell. | “For a lot of people, they would maybe get nervous if they’ve got a YouTube following. Going on a show like ours can work for you or against you. If you’re good, it’s going to benefit you. If you’re not, to be honest, you might as well stay on YouTube,” says Cowell. |
| Would he ever consider starting a talent show on social media then taking it to television? “We’ve discussed that a lot,” he says. “I can’t give too much away, because I’ve done that in the past and have regretted it.” In other words, yes. | Would he ever consider starting a talent show on social media then taking it to television? “We’ve discussed that a lot,” he says. “I can’t give too much away, because I’ve done that in the past and have regretted it.” In other words, yes. |
| Cowell says he is alive to the danger that younger viewers will drift away from X Factor because they’re more interested in YouTubers, though. “We ignore all these things at our peril,” he says, while claiming that he’s not seeing such a drain yet. | Cowell says he is alive to the danger that younger viewers will drift away from X Factor because they’re more interested in YouTubers, though. “We ignore all these things at our peril,” he says, while claiming that he’s not seeing such a drain yet. |
| “With X Factor, if you look at the 16-34 share, it’s massive still. That was always my worry: the show was going to date. But we’re getting more young viewers watching X Factor now. But I do read and listen and act on what people on the internet are saying. I don’t get in a huff about it.” | “With X Factor, if you look at the 16-34 share, it’s massive still. That was always my worry: the show was going to date. But we’re getting more young viewers watching X Factor now. But I do read and listen and act on what people on the internet are saying. I don’t get in a huff about it.” |
| Social media growth | Social media growth |
| If there’s a crossover between YouTube and TV talent shows, it might be in the latter using some of the tactics that have created stars on the former. | If there’s a crossover between YouTube and TV talent shows, it might be in the latter using some of the tactics that have created stars on the former. |
| For example, Cowell admits that with 16 contestants starting the current phase of X Factor in the UK, it’s initially a challenge helping viewers get to know them purely through their performances and 45-second introductions. | For example, Cowell admits that with 16 contestants starting the current phase of X Factor in the UK, it’s initially a challenge helping viewers get to know them purely through their performances and 45-second introductions. |
| The kind of daily video-blogging (vlogging) that drives a lot of YouTubers’ success might be the answer, in between episodes. And they would also be building up their YouTube subscribers and Twitter/Facebook followings ready for whatever comes after the series ends. | The kind of daily video-blogging (vlogging) that drives a lot of YouTubers’ success might be the answer, in between episodes. And they would also be building up their YouTube subscribers and Twitter/Facebook followings ready for whatever comes after the series ends. |
| Cowell is well aware of the growing importance of social media to shows like X Factor and Got Talent, not just in terms of viewers chatting about them as they air, but for building the profile of contestants in that way. | Cowell is well aware of the growing importance of social media to shows like X Factor and Got Talent, not just in terms of viewers chatting about them as they air, but for building the profile of contestants in that way. |
| “With One Direction, the longer they stayed on the show, the bigger the followers became, and after the show there was this group of superfans who made it their mission to break this band: to be our marketing department,” he says. | “With One Direction, the longer they stayed on the show, the bigger the followers became, and after the show there was this group of superfans who made it their mission to break this band: to be our marketing department,” he says. |
| “It was astonishing. When it works, it’s absolutely fantastic. If they’re smart on the shows, they’ll build up their followings as quickly as possible, and I would encourage that.” | “It was astonishing. When it works, it’s absolutely fantastic. If they’re smart on the shows, they’ll build up their followings as quickly as possible, and I would encourage that.” |
| Apps and viewer interaction | Apps and viewer interaction |
| What about technological innovation around a show like X Factor’s mechanics? One of the other trends at MIPCOM is shows that come with companion apps for viewers to interact while they’re on air – not just voting, but affecting what’s happening on screen. | What about technological innovation around a show like X Factor’s mechanics? One of the other trends at MIPCOM is shows that come with companion apps for viewers to interact while they’re on air – not just voting, but affecting what’s happening on screen. |
| Cowell warns against gimmicks on this front: he didn’t like Channel 4’s The Singer Takes It All, for example, with its contestants moving forwards and backwards on conveyor belts as they sang, in response to live voting. | Cowell warns against gimmicks on this front: he didn’t like Channel 4’s The Singer Takes It All, for example, with its contestants moving forwards and backwards on conveyor belts as they sang, in response to live voting. |
| “It should have been The Singer Takes a Fall,” he grins. During his MIPCOM keynote, he also took a pop at Rising Star, a much-hyped format that saw a wall lowered to reveal contestants to the studio audience if enough people voted at home. “For me a show is not about a wall going up and down,” he said then. | “It should have been The Singer Takes a Fall,” he grins. During his MIPCOM keynote, he also took a pop at Rising Star, a much-hyped format that saw a wall lowered to reveal contestants to the studio audience if enough people voted at home. “For me a show is not about a wall going up and down,” he said then. |
| Even so, more real-time interaction is making its way into Syco’s shows. “We’ve got the [X Factor] app now, and it’s free voting and we allow people to vote at the top of the show, so in a sense you’re taking part rather than having to wait for the recap element. That’s a step in the right direction,” he says. | Even so, more real-time interaction is making its way into Syco’s shows. “We’ve got the [X Factor] app now, and it’s free voting and we allow people to vote at the top of the show, so in a sense you’re taking part rather than having to wait for the recap element. That’s a step in the right direction,” he says. |
| “I like the idea of the viewers kinda getting more interactive in terms of the songs they’re going to sing. You’ll see that later on with the songs in the series. But I’m slightly nervous that technology almost overrules what should be a singing show. | “I like the idea of the viewers kinda getting more interactive in terms of the songs they’re going to sing. You’ll see that later on with the songs in the series. But I’m slightly nervous that technology almost overrules what should be a singing show. |
| “This is something I’m very conscious about at the moment: I always think these shows work when there really is a connection between the contestant and the people at home. But I would like the audience at home to feel involved and invested. We have to do it slowly rather than make radical changes.” | “This is something I’m very conscious about at the moment: I always think these shows work when there really is a connection between the contestant and the people at home. But I would like the audience at home to feel involved and invested. We have to do it slowly rather than make radical changes.” |
| Netflix, Amazon and new TV platforms | Netflix, Amazon and new TV platforms |
| Yet another theme at MIPCOM is the way digital services from Netflix and Amazon to PlayStation and Hulu are commissioning original TV shows. A lot of this has focused on drama – House of Cards, Orange Is The New Black and so on – but Netflix recently poached US comedian Chelsea Handler to make a new chat-show for its service. | Yet another theme at MIPCOM is the way digital services from Netflix and Amazon to PlayStation and Hulu are commissioning original TV shows. A lot of this has focused on drama – House of Cards, Orange Is The New Black and so on – but Netflix recently poached US comedian Chelsea Handler to make a new chat-show for its service. |
| Is the next step for that kind of company to come to Cowell for a big entertainment show? “We’re going to announce something soon which is quite a big show, and it’s not on a cable network, and not on a major network. It’s somewhere else. I think it’s hopefully a bit of a game changer,” says Cowell. | Is the next step for that kind of company to come to Cowell for a big entertainment show? “We’re going to announce something soon which is quite a big show, and it’s not on a cable network, and not on a major network. It’s somewhere else. I think it’s hopefully a bit of a game changer,” says Cowell. |
| “The market’s suddenly got much bigger: there are a lot of these people out there. House of Cards was part of the reason: people now have confidence that you don’t have to be a broadcaster to make money on these things. And inevitably those kind of people will want entertainment shows. We could do a whole show in a week or two weeks… we’re not dependent on a network schedule any more.” | “The market’s suddenly got much bigger: there are a lot of these people out there. House of Cards was part of the reason: people now have confidence that you don’t have to be a broadcaster to make money on these things. And inevitably those kind of people will want entertainment shows. We could do a whole show in a week or two weeks… we’re not dependent on a network schedule any more.” |
| Later in the conversation, he mentions that “the show we’re announcing this month or next month took three years to develop”, so this has clearly been a long time coming. | Later in the conversation, he mentions that “the show we’re announcing this month or next month took three years to develop”, so this has clearly been a long time coming. |
| One advantage to a deal with someone like a Netflix or an Amazon would be the chance to launch the same show across different countries, rather than licensing individual versions for each country as happens with shows like X Factor. | One advantage to a deal with someone like a Netflix or an Amazon would be the chance to launch the same show across different countries, rather than licensing individual versions for each country as happens with shows like X Factor. |
| “That’s something we’ve been thinking of for more than three years. A long, long time. I think it’s going to get easier,” he says, although the memory of World Idol – a one-off edition of the Idol format that saw Will Young and Kelly Clarkson competing against other winners from around the world – serves as a cautionary tale. | “That’s something we’ve been thinking of for more than three years. A long, long time. I think it’s going to get easier,” he says, although the memory of World Idol – a one-off edition of the Idol format that saw Will Young and Kelly Clarkson competing against other winners from around the world – serves as a cautionary tale. |
| “They tried the Idol one and it was so bad, it just put everyone off. There was something like 11 or 16 judges!” he says. “And judging took about half an hour on every act, and every judge had been put on the show to be me: it was who could be ruder?” | “They tried the Idol one and it was so bad, it just put everyone off. There was something like 11 or 16 judges!” he says. “And judging took about half an hour on every act, and every judge had been put on the show to be me: it was who could be ruder?” |
| No brush off for Bake Off | No brush off for Bake Off |
| During his keynote at the conference, Cowell had seemed to take a jab at another show: Great British Bake Off, telling the audience: “My belief is it’s more exciting to see someone like Leona Lewis win and sing a fantastic song, than looking at a chocolate eclair at the end of the show.” | During his keynote at the conference, Cowell had seemed to take a jab at another show: Great British Bake Off, telling the audience: “My belief is it’s more exciting to see someone like Leona Lewis win and sing a fantastic song, than looking at a chocolate eclair at the end of the show.” |
| He’s keen to clarify that remark: he says he wasn’t picking on Bake Off specifically, but competitive cookery shows in general. “I think what they’ve done with Bake Off is clever. I was thinking about some other cooking shows, which seem to be everywhere at the moment,” he says. | He’s keen to clarify that remark: he says he wasn’t picking on Bake Off specifically, but competitive cookery shows in general. “I think what they’ve done with Bake Off is clever. I was thinking about some other cooking shows, which seem to be everywhere at the moment,” he says. |
| Cowell sees the positive side of Bake Off’s popularity in the UK, though. “It’s quite heartening that in the middle of the week there are 12m people who will watch something like that,” he says. “I’ve heard some gloom and doom stories about people not watching TV any more. If you engage them, they’ll watch it.” | Cowell sees the positive side of Bake Off’s popularity in the UK, though. “It’s quite heartening that in the middle of the week there are 12m people who will watch something like that,” he says. “I’ve heard some gloom and doom stories about people not watching TV any more. If you engage them, they’ll watch it.” |
| Cowell also has views on the way reality television has been evolving, although it seems he’s not a fan of “scripted-reality” shows like Made in Chelsea and The Only Way Is Essex. “There’s a lot of junk under the term ‘reality’ which is the most non-reality I’ve ever seen in my life,” he says. | Cowell also has views on the way reality television has been evolving, although it seems he’s not a fan of “scripted-reality” shows like Made in Chelsea and The Only Way Is Essex. “There’s a lot of junk under the term ‘reality’ which is the most non-reality I’ve ever seen in my life,” he says. |
| “People just being told to say things, or situations being set up to create drama. It’s the opposite of reality, and people are getting bored of it I think. I’m getting bored of it!” | “People just being told to say things, or situations being set up to create drama. It’s the opposite of reality, and people are getting bored of it I think. I’m getting bored of it!” |
| As the roundtable draws to a close, Cowell has a few more thoughts on technology as it relates not just to the television industry, but to his old stomping ground of music. | As the roundtable draws to a close, Cowell has a few more thoughts on technology as it relates not just to the television industry, but to his old stomping ground of music. |
| “What is happening on our phones, and obviously iTunes is setting the way, particularly for younger record buyers, it’s probably the most exciting thing that’s happened since I’ve been in the music business,” he said. | “What is happening on our phones, and obviously iTunes is setting the way, particularly for younger record buyers, it’s probably the most exciting thing that’s happened since I’ve been in the music business,” he said. |
| “When you’ve got 40 million people all effectively carrying a record player in their back pockets, and the ability that they can hear something and buy it within 30 seconds? We would be total idiots to mess that up. | “When you’ve got 40 million people all effectively carrying a record player in their back pockets, and the ability that they can hear something and buy it within 30 seconds? We would be total idiots to mess that up. |
| “You’re going to see more people buying tracks immediately after our shows, and this is something, if we’ve got the shows in 50-odd countries, we’ve got to do this properly now.” | “You’re going to see more people buying tracks immediately after our shows, and this is something, if we’ve got the shows in 50-odd countries, we’ve got to do this properly now.” |
| • From YouTube to Vice – 10 trends changing how we watch TV | • From YouTube to Vice – 10 trends changing how we watch TV |
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