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You can find the current article at its original source at http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012/jan/30/leveson-inquiry-stephen-abell-tim-toulmin-live
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| Leveson inquiry: Stephen Abell and Tim Toulmin - live | Leveson inquiry: Stephen Abell and Tim Toulmin - live |
| (40 minutes later) | |
| 10.41am: Jay says use of the word "consider" in the PCC's terms meant that it could include the ability to investigate practices including phone hacking. | |
| Toulmin says "that is not how it [the word 'consider'] has been taken". | |
| "I think if that had have been put to me at the time I would have wanted to take some legal advice," he adds. | |
| Leveson interjects: "Well, what does it mean then?" | |
| Toulmin says that the motivation was to be able to talk about issues around the PCC code that did not relate to the complaint. | |
| "The phone-hacking exercise speaks for itself in a way," he tells Leveson. "All the questions that the PCC asked have been well established in the public domain. And it was with the genuine public interest in mind … that lessons would be learned more widely." | |
| 10.40am: Jay runs through the section of the PCC's articles of accociation relating to complaints, which read: | |
| 53.1 The primary function of the commission shall be to consider, and adjudicate, conciliate and resolve or settle by reference to the press code of practice promulgated by Pressbof for the time being in force complaints from the public of unjust or unfair treatment by newspapers, periodicals or magazines and of unwarranted infringements of privacy through material published in newspapers, periodicals or magazines (in each case excluding advertising by third parties) or in connection with the obtaining of such material but shall not consider complaints of any other nature. | |
| 53.1A It shall also be the function of commission to consider and pronounce on issues relating to the code of practice which the commission, in its absolute discretion considers to be in the public interests. | |
| 53.2 All complaints shall be made in writing save that the commission may consider formal complaints made orally to the commission and notify the relevant publisher of any such complaint (but not adjudicate on the merits thereof) for the purpose of enabling the publisher to review the complaint and take any necessary action to prevent the anticipated unjust or unfair treatment or to limit or put an end to the unwarranted infringement of privacy complained of. | |
| 53.3 A complaint may be made by an individual or by a body of persons (whether incorporated or not) but, in addition to the requirements of article 53.1, shall only be entertained or its consideration proceeded with if it appears to the commission that: | |
| (a) the complaint is made by the person affected or by a person authorised by him to make the complaint; | |
| (b) the matter complained of is not the subject of proceedings in a court of law or tribunal in the United Kingdom; and | |
| (c) where the matter complained of is a matter in respect of which the person affected has a remedy by way of proceedings in a court of law in the United Kingdom, in the particular circumstances it is appropriate for the commission to consider a complaint about it. | |
| 53.4 Notwithstanding the provisions of article 53.3, the commission shall have discretion to consider any complaint from whatever source that it considers appropriate to the effective discharge of its function. | |
| 10.33am: Jay is taking Toulmin through the PCC's articles of association. | |
| Its objects are objects to consider, adjudicate, conciliate, resolve and settle complaints. | |
| Jay puts it to Toulmin that its powers are "fairly wide"; he agrees. | |
| 10.28am: The PCC can adapt very quickly, Toulmin says, adding that it benefits from not being underpinned by statute. | |
| Jay asks if Toulmin is suggesting that the PCC is more powerful because of the lack of statutory backstop. | |
| "I'd prefer what I've said: it's flexible. It can react quickly to complainants or to events," Toulmin replies. | |
| 10.26am: Toulmin is asked about the PCC's response to phone-hacking allegations in 2005. | |
| He says that after the convictions of Clive Goodman and Glenn Mulcaire in 2005: "The PCC was faced with a decision … over whether to do nothing … or whether it was in a position to establish what was going to be done to make sure it didn't happen again. The whole industry took note." | |
| Toulmin says the PCC decided to produce a "forward-looking" report and establish principles of internal governance so there would be no repeat. | |
| Jay asks if it was an exercise in establishing why phone hacking had occurred at the News of the World. | |
| "We weren't going over the facts of the Goodman/Mulcaire case which had been dispensed by the courts," Toulmin replies. "We were looking at how it arose, and the culture." | |
| 10.21am: There are a number of laws that act to regulate the press, Toulmin says, mentioning "phone hacking and payments to police". | |
| Toulmin describes the PCC as over and above the existing statute. | |
| He adds that the body has no investigative powers. | |
| 10.18am: Toulmin is asked to define the term "self-regulation". | |
| He says the term is useful as it makes clear that "the industry is behind what's going on" and there is no statute involved. | |
| "Self-regulation is a reasonably well-established concept," he adds. | |
| Toulmin says the PCC is not a regulator – it's a "complaints body … a sort of ombudsman". | |
| 10.13am: The inquiry is now under way. Tim Toulmin, former director of the PCC, is the first witness of the day. | |
| 9.45am: The four former and current Sun journalists who were arrested by police on Saturday morning over alleged payments to police have been bailed. | 9.45am: The four former and current Sun journalists who were arrested by police on Saturday morning over alleged payments to police have been bailed. |
| This is a brief report from Press Association: | This is a brief report from Press Association: |
| Four former and current Sun journalists and a serving Metropolitan Police officer arrested over alleged illegal police payments have been bailed by detectives. | Four former and current Sun journalists and a serving Metropolitan Police officer arrested over alleged illegal police payments have been bailed by detectives. |
| Senior Sun employees Chris Pharo, 42, and Mike Sullivan along with former executives Fergus Shanahan, 57, and Graham Dudman, were named by sources as suspects facing corruption allegations. | Senior Sun employees Chris Pharo, 42, and Mike Sullivan along with former executives Fergus Shanahan, 57, and Graham Dudman, were named by sources as suspects facing corruption allegations. |
| Scotland Yard confirmed five men detained yesterday by officers from Operation Elveden, launched following the phone hacking scandal, had been released pending further inquiries. | Scotland Yard confirmed five men detained yesterday by officers from Operation Elveden, launched following the phone hacking scandal, had been released pending further inquiries. |
| 9.34am: Good morning and welcome to the Leveson inquiry live blog. | 9.34am: Good morning and welcome to the Leveson inquiry live blog. |
| Today marks the start of a week of evidence from past and present executives from the Press Complaints Commission. Today, the inquiry will hear from the serving PCC director, Stephen Abell. | Today marks the start of a week of evidence from past and present executives from the Press Complaints Commission. Today, the inquiry will hear from the serving PCC director, Stephen Abell. |
| Abell took over as director of the PCC in December 2009, a month after the commission's flawed report into phone hacking allegations made by the Guardian in July that year. | Abell took over as director of the PCC in December 2009, a month after the commission's flawed report into phone hacking allegations made by the Guardian in July that year. |
| Tim Toulmin, director of the PCC at the time of its phone-hacking report, will also give evidence. | Tim Toulmin, director of the PCC at the time of its phone-hacking report, will also give evidence. |
| Toulmin was director of the commission between January 2004 and December 2009, and now heads public relations firm Alder Media. | Toulmin was director of the commission between January 2004 and December 2009, and now heads public relations firm Alder Media. |
| Follow the inquiry live from 10am. | Follow the inquiry live from 10am. |
| Please note that comments have been switched off for legal reasons. | Please note that comments have been switched off for legal reasons. |