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| Michigan Republicans Tune In to Democratic Debate. No Conversions Reported. | Michigan Republicans Tune In to Democratic Debate. No Conversions Reported. |
| (about 2 hours later) | |
| PORTAGE, Mich. — Not everyone watching Wednesday’s Democratic debate was looking for a hero. | PORTAGE, Mich. — Not everyone watching Wednesday’s Democratic debate was looking for a hero. |
| In a windowless room in southwest Michigan, a political man cave with a signed picture of Ronna McDaniel, the chairwoman of the Republican National Committee, a flat-screen TV was tuned to an unfamiliar destination, MSNBC. A dozen activists with the Republican Party of Kalamazoo County, sat down over pizza and locally brewed Two Hearted Ale to scout the opposition. | In a windowless room in southwest Michigan, a political man cave with a signed picture of Ronna McDaniel, the chairwoman of the Republican National Committee, a flat-screen TV was tuned to an unfamiliar destination, MSNBC. A dozen activists with the Republican Party of Kalamazoo County, sat down over pizza and locally brewed Two Hearted Ale to scout the opposition. |
| After two hours, they got up still confirmed Republicans, but impressed and perhaps wary of some of the competition. | After two hours, they got up still confirmed Republicans, but impressed and perhaps wary of some of the competition. |
| [We tracked down the 2020 Democrats and asked them the same set of questions. Watch them answer.] | [We tracked down the 2020 Democrats and asked them the same set of questions. Watch them answer.] |
| “I think Trump wins Michigan again, but it’s going to be tight,” said David Eyke, the chairman of the county party. | “I think Trump wins Michigan again, but it’s going to be tight,” said David Eyke, the chairman of the county party. |
| Tony Dugal, a commercial photographer, called Senator Elizabeth Warren, the highest polling Democrat on stage, “the most legitimate threat to Trump’s re-election from what I see at this point,” adding, “She’s not afraid to confront the issues.” | Tony Dugal, a commercial photographer, called Senator Elizabeth Warren, the highest polling Democrat on stage, “the most legitimate threat to Trump’s re-election from what I see at this point,” adding, “She’s not afraid to confront the issues.” |
| But Sam Nelson, a political science student who has worked on local campaigns, disagreed. “If they nominate a radical socialist, I think he has a really good chance to win again,” he said of President Trump. | But Sam Nelson, a political science student who has worked on local campaigns, disagreed. “If they nominate a radical socialist, I think he has a really good chance to win again,” he said of President Trump. |
| And Tony Lorentz, an auctioneer, who was the closest to the kind of Trump supporter that journalists tend to find at diner counters, mocked Democrats’ promised programs for tuition-free college and “Medicare for all.” | And Tony Lorentz, an auctioneer, who was the closest to the kind of Trump supporter that journalists tend to find at diner counters, mocked Democrats’ promised programs for tuition-free college and “Medicare for all.” |
| “Free, free,” he said. “What happens when they run out of free?” | “Free, free,” he said. “What happens when they run out of free?” |
| As Ms. Warren attacked the concentration of wealth in a few hands, arguing, “that is corruption pure and simple,” one of the Republican debate-watchers said, “Holy cow, that’s strong language.” | As Ms. Warren attacked the concentration of wealth in a few hands, arguing, “that is corruption pure and simple,” one of the Republican debate-watchers said, “Holy cow, that’s strong language.” |
| “I don’t know, we have the lowest black unemployment,’’ Mr. Nelson responded to Ms. Warren. | “I don’t know, we have the lowest black unemployment,’’ Mr. Nelson responded to Ms. Warren. |
| There were few zingers from candidates on stage in Miami, but the Republican debate-watchers aimed a few of their own at the TV. When Mayor Bill de Blasio of New York said there was plenty of money in America, “it’s just in the wrong hands,” Mr. Lorentz shot back, “It’s in the hands of the people that work for it.” | There were few zingers from candidates on stage in Miami, but the Republican debate-watchers aimed a few of their own at the TV. When Mayor Bill de Blasio of New York said there was plenty of money in America, “it’s just in the wrong hands,” Mr. Lorentz shot back, “It’s in the hands of the people that work for it.” |
| [The latest data and analysis to keep track of who’s leading the race to be the Democratic nominee.] | [The latest data and analysis to keep track of who’s leading the race to be the Democratic nominee.] |
| And as Senator Amy Klobuchar of Minnesota discussed criminal justice reform, one man said, “I’m not feeling it, Amy.” | And as Senator Amy Klobuchar of Minnesota discussed criminal justice reform, one man said, “I’m not feeling it, Amy.” |
| (The dozen men insisted that the Republican Party of Kalamazoo included women, too, but none had answered a last-minute callout to attend.) | |
| Mostly, it was a respectful and interested audience, ages 21 to 75, with professions from student to lawyer to retired police officer. | Mostly, it was a respectful and interested audience, ages 21 to 75, with professions from student to lawyer to retired police officer. |
| Although some had anticipated an evening of Trump bashing, the president’s name was infrequently mentioned from the stage. When it was, the men quickly came to his defense. | Although some had anticipated an evening of Trump bashing, the president’s name was infrequently mentioned from the stage. When it was, the men quickly came to his defense. |
| There were swift objections when former Representative Beto O’Rourke of Texas said the president “has made us weaker as a country.” | There were swift objections when former Representative Beto O’Rourke of Texas said the president “has made us weaker as a country.” |
| “We’re way stronger,” Mr. Nelson said dismissively. | “We’re way stronger,” Mr. Nelson said dismissively. |
| “At least Trump’s trying to get all these allies to pay their fair share,” said Raymond Shoup, a financial adviser. “They’ve gotten to grow free for all those years under our protection.” | “At least Trump’s trying to get all these allies to pay their fair share,” said Raymond Shoup, a financial adviser. “They’ve gotten to grow free for all those years under our protection.” |
| On foreign affairs, the subject of withdrawal from Afghanistan sharply divided the two sitting members of Congress in the debate, Tim Ryan of Ohio and Tulsi Gabbard of Hawaii, and it also divided the debate-watchers. Ms. Gabbard, a veteran of the war in Iraq, cited two Americans killed that day in Afghanistan to argue for withdrawal. | On foreign affairs, the subject of withdrawal from Afghanistan sharply divided the two sitting members of Congress in the debate, Tim Ryan of Ohio and Tulsi Gabbard of Hawaii, and it also divided the debate-watchers. Ms. Gabbard, a veteran of the war in Iraq, cited two Americans killed that day in Afghanistan to argue for withdrawal. |
| “You’re insulting their sacrifice,” Mr. Lorentz said. | “You’re insulting their sacrifice,” Mr. Lorentz said. |
| “She’s absolutely right,” countered Evan Oudekerk, a 21-year-old student. | “She’s absolutely right,” countered Evan Oudekerk, a 21-year-old student. |
| “Evan’s a liberal on this issue,’’ someone said. | “Evan’s a liberal on this issue,’’ someone said. |
| Mr. Oudekerk, who is chairman of the Western Michigan University College Republicans, said he had been a Rand Paul supporter in 2016. “The best thing about Trump is his America First policy,” he said. | Mr. Oudekerk, who is chairman of the Western Michigan University College Republicans, said he had been a Rand Paul supporter in 2016. “The best thing about Trump is his America First policy,” he said. |
| Ms. Gabbard turned out to be the discovery of the night for the Republican crowd, with several praising her for clear and forceful answers. | Ms. Gabbard turned out to be the discovery of the night for the Republican crowd, with several praising her for clear and forceful answers. |
| “Wow, she cuts right through,” Mr. Eyke said when the congresswoman said she wanted to ensure “no sick American goes without getting the care they need, regardless of how much or little money they have in their pocket.” | “Wow, she cuts right through,” Mr. Eyke said when the congresswoman said she wanted to ensure “no sick American goes without getting the care they need, regardless of how much or little money they have in their pocket.” |
| The amount of Spanish spoken during the debate, by three fluent candidates, seemed to make some in the room uneasy. | The amount of Spanish spoken during the debate, by three fluent candidates, seemed to make some in the room uneasy. |
| “Speak the King’s English,” one man said to Mr. O’Rourke at one point. | “Speak the King’s English,” one man said to Mr. O’Rourke at one point. |
| Another mocked what he considered pandering: “Vote Democratic, he speaks Spanish.” | Another mocked what he considered pandering: “Vote Democratic, he speaks Spanish.” |
| But Scott McGraw, a former newspaper publisher, turned serious. “Well, the Hispanic vote could make the difference,” he told the room. | But Scott McGraw, a former newspaper publisher, turned serious. “Well, the Hispanic vote could make the difference,” he told the room. |
| “I really feel like we should be able to get more; they line up with our values,” Mr. Dugal said, referring to Hispanic voters. “We’ve just got to figure out a way.” Mr. Trump, he acknowledged, “has work to do” on the issue. | “I really feel like we should be able to get more; they line up with our values,” Mr. Dugal said, referring to Hispanic voters. “We’ve just got to figure out a way.” Mr. Trump, he acknowledged, “has work to do” on the issue. |
| Immigration brought out the strongest opinions, both on stage and at the debate watch. | Immigration brought out the strongest opinions, both on stage and at the debate watch. |
| “Open those borders!” Mr. Lorentz chided at one point, before pivoting to a favorite subject: “And how are you going to pay for it?” | “Open those borders!” Mr. Lorentz chided at one point, before pivoting to a favorite subject: “And how are you going to pay for it?” |
| As Julián Castro, the former housing secretary and former mayor of San Antonio, mentioned the father and young daughter who drowned trying to swim the Rio Grande, and whose bodies appeared on front pages in a heart-wrenching photo, Mr. Eyke, the county chairman, said: “This is a tragedy, I think we all agree. This is a human rights crisis.” | As Julián Castro, the former housing secretary and former mayor of San Antonio, mentioned the father and young daughter who drowned trying to swim the Rio Grande, and whose bodies appeared on front pages in a heart-wrenching photo, Mr. Eyke, the county chairman, said: “This is a tragedy, I think we all agree. This is a human rights crisis.” |
| “I’m in favor of DACA myself,” he added when the debate turned to that Obama-era policy offering legal protection for migrants brought to the country as children. | “I’m in favor of DACA myself,” he added when the debate turned to that Obama-era policy offering legal protection for migrants brought to the country as children. |
| “I’m not,” another man said. | “I’m not,” another man said. |
| “If you could guarantee DACA didn’t encourage people coming over, I’d be all right with it,” someone else put in. | “If you could guarantee DACA didn’t encourage people coming over, I’d be all right with it,” someone else put in. |
| The conversation veered from the debate to the failed talks between Republicans and Democrats in Washington over border issues. | The conversation veered from the debate to the failed talks between Republicans and Democrats in Washington over border issues. |
| “Give ’em DACA if they work with us on border security,” Mr. Nelson said. “That would be a good deal. But they don’t work with us.” | “Give ’em DACA if they work with us on border security,” Mr. Nelson said. “That would be a good deal. But they don’t work with us.” |
| “All these Democrats just a month ago said this is a man-made crisis at the border,” he added. “Now they know it’s a crisis, but they’re just blaming Donald Trump.” | “All these Democrats just a month ago said this is a man-made crisis at the border,” he added. “Now they know it’s a crisis, but they’re just blaming Donald Trump.” |
| “We’re all pro-immigrant,” Mr. Dugal said. “Everyone I’ve talked to wants immigrants to come, we just want them coming legally.” | “We’re all pro-immigrant,” Mr. Dugal said. “Everyone I’ve talked to wants immigrants to come, we just want them coming legally.” |
| When Governor Jay Inslee of Washington said he would welcome asylum seekers to his state, Mr. Lorentz shot back: “Well, take ’em all. There’s no problem there. You can have ’em all.” | When Governor Jay Inslee of Washington said he would welcome asylum seekers to his state, Mr. Lorentz shot back: “Well, take ’em all. There’s no problem there. You can have ’em all.” |
| The men ended the evening saying Democrats had painted an overly dark picture of America to convince voters that the country needed rescuing from the president. Mr. Trump had begun his term speaking of “American carnage,” but in their view, had brought peace and prosperity. | The men ended the evening saying Democrats had painted an overly dark picture of America to convince voters that the country needed rescuing from the president. Mr. Trump had begun his term speaking of “American carnage,” but in their view, had brought peace and prosperity. |
| “I think we all think things are going better right now,” Mr. Nelson said. | “I think we all think things are going better right now,” Mr. Nelson said. |