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Carrie Gracie: 'I could not collude in unlawful pay discrimination' Carrie Gracie: 'I could not collude in unlawful pay discrimination'
(35 minutes later)
The BBC presenter Carrie Gracie has said she could not collude in unlawful pay discrimination after resigning as the corporation’s China editor in protest at unequal remuneration. The BBC presenter Carrie Gracie has said she could not collude in unlawful pay discrimination after resigning as China editor in protest against unequal remuneration.
In her first full interview since leaving the post, Gracie said she was offered a 33% pay increase but rejected it, claiming she wanted equality, not more money.In her first full interview since leaving the post, Gracie said she was offered a 33% pay increase but rejected it, claiming she wanted equality, not more money.
Speaking on Monday to BBC Radio 4’s Woman’s Hour, Gracie said: “I could not go back to China and collude knowingly in what I consider to be unlawful pay discrimination. Nor could I stay silent and watch the BBC perpetuate a failing pay structure by discriminating against women.” Speaking on Monday to BBC Radio 4’s Woman’s Hour, the veteran journalist said: “I could not go back to China and collude knowingly in what I consider to be unlawful pay discrimination. Nor could I stay silent and watch the BBC perpetuate a failing pay structure by discriminating against women.”
Maria Miller, former cultural secretary now chair of the Commons’ women and equalities select committee, urged the Equality and Human Rights Commission to investigate the BBC for breaching Gracie’s right to equal pay. Maria Miller, a former cultural secretary now chair of the Commons’ women and equalities select committee, urged the Equality and Human Rights Commission to investigate the BBC for breaching Gracie’s right to equal pay.
Speaking to BBC News she added: “Alternatively, they could take a test case, like the Carrie Gracie case to court to demonstrate to other employers that this is serious matter and not something to brush under the carpet and that they are at risk of being taken to court over.”
Evidence suggests @BBC is breaking law using Licence Fee money @EHRC has to use statutory powers to urgently investigate #IStandWithCarrie https://t.co/9gGDUHiYmzEvidence suggests @BBC is breaking law using Licence Fee money @EHRC has to use statutory powers to urgently investigate #IStandWithCarrie https://t.co/9gGDUHiYmz
"The support that I've had speaks to the depth of hunger for an equal, fair and transparent pay system."@BBCCarrie says she has been moved by the support for her resignation over gender pay row. More here 👉 https://t.co/pMJE08Hsoq#r4today pic.twitter.com/J1KuTF40kg"The support that I've had speaks to the depth of hunger for an equal, fair and transparent pay system."@BBCCarrie says she has been moved by the support for her resignation over gender pay row. More here 👉 https://t.co/pMJE08Hsoq#r4today pic.twitter.com/J1KuTF40kg
Gracie confirmed that she first lodged an equal pay complaint in August last year after the BBC was forced to disclose the salaries of employees earning more than £150,000 a year. Gracie confirmed that she first lodged an equal pay complaint in August after the BBC was forced to disclose the salaries of employees earning more than £150,000 a year.
In a letter to licence fee payers, Gracie said she was dismayed to discover the BBC’s two male international editors earned “at least 50% more” than their two female counterparts.In a letter to licence fee payers, Gracie said she was dismayed to discover the BBC’s two male international editors earned “at least 50% more” than their two female counterparts.
The North America editor, Jon Sopel, earned between £200,000 and £249,999, while the Middle East editor, Jeremy Bowen, earned between £150,000 and £199,999.The North America editor, Jon Sopel, earned between £200,000 and £249,999, while the Middle East editor, Jeremy Bowen, earned between £150,000 and £199,999.
Gracie said: “My pay is £135,000. The BBC offered to raise that to £180,000, however I was not interested in more money, I was interested in equality. I didn’t feel it was a solution.Gracie said: “My pay is £135,000. The BBC offered to raise that to £180,000, however I was not interested in more money, I was interested in equality. I didn’t feel it was a solution.
“I felt it was a divide-and-rule botched solution that would not make the BBC better … This was not equality; there was still a big gap between myself and my male peers.”“I felt it was a divide-and-rule botched solution that would not make the BBC better … This was not equality; there was still a big gap between myself and my male peers.”
The BBC confirmed that staff had been told that anyone who showed support for Gracie can no longer report on the issue, under its impartiality rules.The BBC confirmed that staff had been told that anyone who showed support for Gracie can no longer report on the issue, under its impartiality rules.
To circumvent the rules, Gracie was interviewed by the Guardian contributor and former media editor Jane Martinson. She was asked whether she wanted a pay cut for male journalists.To circumvent the rules, Gracie was interviewed by the Guardian contributor and former media editor Jane Martinson. She was asked whether she wanted a pay cut for male journalists.
“I believe in public service broadcasting and I do think salaries at the top are unacceptably high both for presenters and stars of various kinds, and also for managers. But I don’t have the information to say this needs to happen … I do stand by what I say about the BBC being a secretive organisation on pay and I think it is very inappropriate,” she said.“I believe in public service broadcasting and I do think salaries at the top are unacceptably high both for presenters and stars of various kinds, and also for managers. But I don’t have the information to say this needs to happen … I do stand by what I say about the BBC being a secretive organisation on pay and I think it is very inappropriate,” she said.
Gracie said she had yet to hear the outcome of a grievance hearing held in November and had resigned in frustration. “The BBC said it hoped to have a grievance outcome before Christmas, but there is still no grievance outcome to this day. And I just decided enough was enough,” she said.Gracie said she had yet to hear the outcome of a grievance hearing held in November and had resigned in frustration. “The BBC said it hoped to have a grievance outcome before Christmas, but there is still no grievance outcome to this day. And I just decided enough was enough,” she said.
She also pointed out that her role was one of the most important and demanding at the BBC.She also pointed out that her role was one of the most important and demanding at the BBC.
“It is very hard to continue to do the job of China editor, which I do see as one of the most difficult reporting jobs of our time. I chase around being surveilled the whole time and dealing with intimidation, dealing with police harassment … I speak Chinese, I have a degree in Chinese, I’ve been reporting the story for nearly 30 years. I just feel I work hard,” she said. She told the programme how much she had been moved by the support. Briefly interviewed by her co-presenter John Humphrys, whose £600,000-plus pay packet is at more than four times hers, Gracie said: “The support that I’ve had in the last few hours over this … does speak to the depth of hunger for an equal, fair and transparent pay system.
John Whittingdale, the former culture secretary who insisted the BBC publish top salaries, said the pay disclosure had revealed there was still a considerable problem.
“The decision of Carrie Gracie to leave her position because she is being paid far less than some of her male colleagues for doling much the same job, demonstrated the extent to which there is a still a problem that needs to be addressed,” he told the BBC Radio 4’s World at One programme.
He urged BBC director general Tony Hall to set out how the corporation was going to address unequal pay.
Within hours of her resignation, Gracie was sent messages of support from prominent broadcasters and politicians.
Despite being the subject of a news story, she took the unusual step of going ahead with a scheduled appearance as a presenter of the BBC’s Today programme on Radio 4.
She told the programme how much she had been moved by the support. Briefly interviewed by her co-presenter John Humphrys, whose £600,000-plus pay packet is at least four times more than hers, Gracie said: “The support that I’ve had in the last few hours over this … does speak to the depth of hunger for an equal, fair and transparent pay system.
“What is lovely for me is that people are mentioning my China work, because I would not wish to be remembered for ever as the woman who complained about money.”“What is lovely for me is that people are mentioning my China work, because I would not wish to be remembered for ever as the woman who complained about money.”
Humphrys interrupted her to say “too late, too late”, before going on to praise his colleague’s stint as China editor.Humphrys interrupted her to say “too late, too late”, before going on to praise his colleague’s stint as China editor.
Gracie said: “I want to be remembered as the person who did some fine China work, and enough people are saying that for me to feel that will not get buried as a result of all this.”Gracie said: “I want to be remembered as the person who did some fine China work, and enough people are saying that for me to feel that will not get buried as a result of all this.”
Sarah Montague, the least well-paid of the regular Today programme presenters, was one of 130 broadcasters and producers to sign a message of support for Gracie’s protest.Sarah Montague, the least well-paid of the regular Today programme presenters, was one of 130 broadcasters and producers to sign a message of support for Gracie’s protest.
Statement from #bbcwomen in support of @BBCCarrie #EqualPay #IStandWithCarrie pic.twitter.com/tueh1aCW8WStatement from #bbcwomen in support of @BBCCarrie #EqualPay #IStandWithCarrie pic.twitter.com/tueh1aCW8W
It urged the BBC to “urgently address pay inequality across the corporation” and pointed out that 200 women at the BBC had made pay complaints.It urged the BBC to “urgently address pay inequality across the corporation” and pointed out that 200 women at the BBC had made pay complaints.
A number of politicians voiced their support, including the Scottish first minister, Nicola Sturgeon, the shadow work and pensions secretary, Debbie Abrahams, and the former deputy Labour leader Harriet Harman.A number of politicians voiced their support, including the Scottish first minister, Nicola Sturgeon, the shadow work and pensions secretary, Debbie Abrahams, and the former deputy Labour leader Harriet Harman.
This @BBCCarrie letter is a must read. All respect to her. https://t.co/9CvZrsyWLRThis @BBCCarrie letter is a must read. All respect to her. https://t.co/9CvZrsyWLR
The Labour peer Lord Foulkes, who demanded that Gracie reveal how much she was paid during a live interview about MPs’ pay in 2009, said he agreed with her campaign for parity.The Labour peer Lord Foulkes, who demanded that Gracie reveal how much she was paid during a live interview about MPs’ pay in 2009, said he agreed with her campaign for parity.
A BBC spokesman said: “Fairness in pay is vital. A significant number of organisations have now published their gender pay figures, showing that we are performing considerably better than many and are well below the national average.A BBC spokesman said: “Fairness in pay is vital. A significant number of organisations have now published their gender pay figures, showing that we are performing considerably better than many and are well below the national average.
“Alongside that, we have already conducted an independent judge-led audit of pay for rank-and-file staff which showed no systemic discrimination against women.“Alongside that, we have already conducted an independent judge-led audit of pay for rank-and-file staff which showed no systemic discrimination against women.
“A separate report for on-air staff will be published in the not too distant future.”“A separate report for on-air staff will be published in the not too distant future.”