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MPs' expenses vote 'harms trust' | MPs' expenses vote 'harms trust' |
(about 1 hour later) | |
MPs' rejection of tough expenses rules will make it "very hard" to alter the perception they have their "snouts in the trough," a senior MP has warned. | MPs' rejection of tough expenses rules will make it "very hard" to alter the perception they have their "snouts in the trough," a senior MP has warned. |
Lib Dem Nick Harvey, who helped draw up tougher rules, said the vote created a "real headache" for those trying to rebuild public confidence. | Lib Dem Nick Harvey, who helped draw up tougher rules, said the vote created a "real headache" for those trying to rebuild public confidence. |
External auditing and spot checks were "absolutely vital", he said. | External auditing and spot checks were "absolutely vital", he said. |
More than 30 ministers were among those rejecting tougher rules. Some argued external audits would be too costly. | More than 30 ministers were among those rejecting tougher rules. Some argued external audits would be too costly. |
Proposals to change the system were drawn up after a five-month inquiry by the Members Estimate Committee, chaired by Speaker Michael Martin, after Tory MP Derek Conway was reprimanded for overpaying his son for Parliamentary work. | Proposals to change the system were drawn up after a five-month inquiry by the Members Estimate Committee, chaired by Speaker Michael Martin, after Tory MP Derek Conway was reprimanded for overpaying his son for Parliamentary work. |
'One-way argument' | 'One-way argument' |
They included an end to the so-called "John Lewis list" - the use of public money to pay for items like new kitchens and household goods such as TVs - and replaced the additional costs allowance, used to cover the cost of running a second home. | |
And they called for spot checks and external auditing of MPs expenses. | And they called for spot checks and external auditing of MPs expenses. |
MPs are the only people in the country who sign off their own expenses Nick HarveyMembers Estimate Committee | MPs are the only people in the country who sign off their own expenses Nick HarveyMembers Estimate Committee |
Mr Harvey told BBC Radio 4's Today programme both measures were "absolutely vital" to try to rebuild public confidence in Parliament. | |
"The fact that the public's hard-earned money can be used for MPs to buy and then indeed own a plasma television is just a one-way argument in public perception that we were never going to win," he said. | |
'Real headache' | 'Real headache' |
He added: "MPs are the only people in the country who sign off their own expenses." | |
Asked about one newspaper headline, suggesting MPs had voted to "keep their snouts in the trough", Mr Harvey said: "It's very, very hard to see how we are going to tackle that perception because a set of rules to try and bring everything under control was put up and has now been voted down. | |
"And I think collectively we've got a real headache as a result of the vote yesterday." | |
Why should someone come round my office and do an effective time and motion study on my staff - when I'm technically self employed? Peter KilfoyleLabour backbencher | |
On Thursday, following debates on pay and expenses, MPs voted by a majority of 28 to retain the additional costs allowance, and to have their spending looked at only by internal, rather than external, auditors. | On Thursday, following debates on pay and expenses, MPs voted by a majority of 28 to retain the additional costs allowance, and to have their spending looked at only by internal, rather than external, auditors. |
More than 30 government ministers, including Home Secretary Jacqui Smith, Culture Secretary Andy Burnham and Northern Ireland Secretary Shaun Woodward, voted to keep the old allowance. | More than 30 government ministers, including Home Secretary Jacqui Smith, Culture Secretary Andy Burnham and Northern Ireland Secretary Shaun Woodward, voted to keep the old allowance. |
Gordon Brown was not at the vote - the Conservatives accused him of "going awol (absent without leave)" and "showing blatant contempt for very real public concerns". The shadow cabinet voted for the tighter system. | |
'Great cost' | |
Labour MP David Winnick said it had been a "missed opportunity" which "gives the impression of an abuse of public expenditure". | |
But Labour former minister Peter Kilfoyle rejected the notion that by opposing the new rules he had voted to keep the "John Lewis list" - saying that was something drawn up by Commons officials not MPs. | |
He told the BBC he was very concerned about teams of external auditors "at very great cost" being able to "to trawl through individual MP's office". | He told the BBC he was very concerned about teams of external auditors "at very great cost" being able to "to trawl through individual MP's office". |
Sir Christopher Kelly had questioned whether the new rules went far enough | |
Mr Kilfoyle said all receipts were audited in the Commons fees office adding: "Why should someone come round my office and do an effective time and motion study on my staff - when I'm technically self employed?" | Mr Kilfoyle said all receipts were audited in the Commons fees office adding: "Why should someone come round my office and do an effective time and motion study on my staff - when I'm technically self employed?" |
There were also questions about whether the new system might be too bureaucratic - and who would police a new overnight allowance - to be claimed for every night they stayed in London. | |
MPs' expenses came under scrutiny after the Derek Conway case and a Freedom of Information tribunal ruling that details of MPs' second homes allowance claims should be published. | MPs' expenses came under scrutiny after the Derek Conway case and a Freedom of Information tribunal ruling that details of MPs' second homes allowance claims should be published. |
An information tribunal criticised the existing rules as "deeply unsatisfactory", said checks were "very limited" and said the "laxity" rules was "very different" from those in the private sector. | |
Some new rules have already been brought in. MPs employing relatives have begun declaring them and MPs must now submit receipts on all items worth more than £25 - previously they could claim up to £250 without providing a receipt. | |
Sir Christopher Kelly, chairman of the Committee on Standards in Public Life, last week questioned whether even the new rules went far enough. | |
Asked about Thursday's vote to reject reforms, he said: "I would expect the public to react very badly." |
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