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| What do you think of the iPhone 7? Join our live look at the week | What do you think of the iPhone 7? Join our live look at the week |
| (35 minutes later) | |
| 3.03pm BST | |
| 15:03 | |
| 'Freaks on the peaks': the lonely lives of the last remaining forest fire lookouts | |
| Rory Carroll | |
| I heard about the lookouts a few months ago while reporting another fire-related story, about Smokejumpers, and so lobbied the US Forest service to visit one. The trip up to the Stonewall lookout in Montana is, as you’d expect, gorgeous. But also stark. A big fire scorched the forest in 2003 and it’s still recovering. One dilemma with this story was using the term “freaks”. Lookouts use the term themselves as an insider, jokey term but in print it could seem harsh and mocking. Judging by the near universally positive reactions of readers – everyone seems to want to do this job – I think the article makes clear lookouts have an important and special role. | |
| What articles did you enjoy this week? Share them in the comments. | |
| 2.47pm BST | |
| 14:47 | |
| Star Trek 50th anniversary | |
| From the archive, we’ve got these articles on the beloved Star Trek. One is from June 1974 and the other is from February 1973, about an annual Star Trek convention. | |
| They comes as Star Trek turns 50 this week, making those of us who grew up on the progressive, optimistic science fiction franchise feeling rather out of time in an increasingly non-progressive era. A reminder, if you’re a fan we’re also collecting your Star Trek stories and pictures – click the blue GuardianWitness buttons to find out more. | |
| 2.07pm BST | 2.07pm BST |
| 14:07 | 14:07 |
| Did the latest iPhone launch event excite you? | Did the latest iPhone launch event excite you? |
| Matthew Holmes | Matthew Holmes |
| Tech news this week was dominated (sorry, Playstation fans) by Apple’s announcement of a new phone, and, as well as its wearable (obviously) Watch, some new “loseables” in the form of the Airpod wireless headphones. | Tech news this week was dominated (sorry, Playstation fans) by Apple’s announcement of a new phone, and, as well as its wearable (obviously) Watch, some new “loseables” in the form of the Airpod wireless headphones. |
| $159/£120?? based on my consumption of £5 headphones from Tesco I reckon an iphone 7 will cost me about two grand a year. | $159/£120?? based on my consumption of £5 headphones from Tesco I reckon an iphone 7 will cost me about two grand a year. |
| Our readers had predicted what new features there might be after the Technology desk asked them what they thought the company might do next. They were, pretty much, spot on, and we also saw predictably “mixed” reaction as the announcements came. | Our readers had predicted what new features there might be after the Technology desk asked them what they thought the company might do next. They were, pretty much, spot on, and we also saw predictably “mixed” reaction as the announcements came. |
| And just when we thought the year couldn't get any worse, Apple goes and drops the trusted headphone jack. | And just when we thought the year couldn't get any worse, Apple goes and drops the trusted headphone jack. |
| Stupid, stupid, stupid. | Stupid, stupid, stupid. |
| You can't beat cables for sound quality. No wireless transmission has yet been able to match a simple cable for uncompressed sound quality. | You can't beat cables for sound quality. No wireless transmission has yet been able to match a simple cable for uncompressed sound quality. |
| No 7 for me. | No 7 for me. |
| What do you think? Is the phone just a fashion accessory? Perhaps you’re genuinely excited? Or maybe your interest was most piqued by the prospect of a new Mario game to ship with the handsets. | What do you think? Is the phone just a fashion accessory? Perhaps you’re genuinely excited? Or maybe your interest was most piqued by the prospect of a new Mario game to ship with the handsets. |
| Whatever you’re thinking, let us know in the comments below. | Whatever you’re thinking, let us know in the comments below. |
| 1.56pm BST | 1.56pm BST |
| 13:56 | 13:56 |
| The future of the left is a topic you won’t move away from quickly – there’s been some really interesting exchanges and we hope they continue. If you spot a comment up here you can click on it to scroll directly to that point in the conversation – and get involved. | The future of the left is a topic you won’t move away from quickly – there’s been some really interesting exchanges and we hope they continue. If you spot a comment up here you can click on it to scroll directly to that point in the conversation – and get involved. |
| Agree with Harris. Labour's dead. And it wont take a long time before the tories realise that the same thing is going to happen to them. The party's been captured by the hard right-wing and, at some point, the centrists will become a complete irrelevance. | Agree with Harris. Labour's dead. And it wont take a long time before the tories realise that the same thing is going to happen to them. The party's been captured by the hard right-wing and, at some point, the centrists will become a complete irrelevance. |
| What we may see is a fragmentation, even atomisation, of mainstream political parties. In both the case of Labour and the Tories, the parties are increasingly becoming representative of narrow interest of core members. Tory members have always been very euro-sceptic and held a strong anti-immigration line. The brexit vote has legitimised those views and those euro-sceptic MPs who were once on the fringes and largely dismissed by their peers are now the ones calling the shots. The narrow victory by the Leave campaign has given them the confidence to push forward policies and ideas that are hugely divisive in the mistaken belief that these policies are supporters by a broad church. The way in which the Tory party has framed the Brexit vote as an almost exclusively anti-immigration vote and have pushed for grammar schools (despite the fact it was not in their manifesto) are good examples of this phenomenon. With Labour, you have a so-called social movement which demands that all MPS reflect the views of the majority of the membership, instead of looking to reflect the wide spectrum of interest and views of Labour voters. Just like the Tories they believe that this narrow movement holds great support across the UK. If only the media would give them a fair shot. If only the MPs would support the leader. If, if ... | What we may see is a fragmentation, even atomisation, of mainstream political parties. In both the case of Labour and the Tories, the parties are increasingly becoming representative of narrow interest of core members. Tory members have always been very euro-sceptic and held a strong anti-immigration line. The brexit vote has legitimised those views and those euro-sceptic MPs who were once on the fringes and largely dismissed by their peers are now the ones calling the shots. The narrow victory by the Leave campaign has given them the confidence to push forward policies and ideas that are hugely divisive in the mistaken belief that these policies are supporters by a broad church. The way in which the Tory party has framed the Brexit vote as an almost exclusively anti-immigration vote and have pushed for grammar schools (despite the fact it was not in their manifesto) are good examples of this phenomenon. With Labour, you have a so-called social movement which demands that all MPS reflect the views of the majority of the membership, instead of looking to reflect the wide spectrum of interest and views of Labour voters. Just like the Tories they believe that this narrow movement holds great support across the UK. If only the media would give them a fair shot. If only the MPs would support the leader. If, if ... |
| There is of course no need to have parties that act as broad and inclusive churches. There's nothing wrong with having parties that represent very specific and narrow interest. But if the political system is dominated by such parties then you need a system of proportional representation. And we wont get that until the Tories realise its in their interests to have one. | There is of course no need to have parties that act as broad and inclusive churches. There's nothing wrong with having parties that represent very specific and narrow interest. But if the political system is dominated by such parties then you need a system of proportional representation. And we wont get that until the Tories realise its in their interests to have one. |
| It's not quite that Labour's dead, which is why I talk about the end of the Labour Party as we know it. Some (or a lot) of what it encompasses at the moment will be part of the left's future: e.g if the leadership of the unions would start to better answer the question of how to organise in a fragmented, "platform" economy, we'd get a sense of their (absolutely necessary) involvement. | It's not quite that Labour's dead, which is why I talk about the end of the Labour Party as we know it. Some (or a lot) of what it encompasses at the moment will be part of the left's future: e.g if the leadership of the unions would start to better answer the question of how to organise in a fragmented, "platform" economy, we'd get a sense of their (absolutely necessary) involvement. |
| Two questions usually give you a sense of whether a group or individual has a sense of the left's future: 1)Do they want to change the electoral system and embrace plural politics, and 2)Are they interested in UBI? (Note: a depressingly large swathe of Labour, left and right, would answer 'No' to both) | Two questions usually give you a sense of whether a group or individual has a sense of the left's future: 1)Do they want to change the electoral system and embrace plural politics, and 2)Are they interested in UBI? (Note: a depressingly large swathe of Labour, left and right, would answer 'No' to both) |
| Has the left a future? Possibly if it comes up with new solutions to the issues of today rather than using old failed solutions. Millions more people each year are gaining standards of living that only the elite could afford a generation ago but the left don't like to focus on the positives - hence the move to talk about inequality of wealth rather than whether standards of living are rising (you can have zero wealth but a decent standard of living). The left needs to talk about real solutions and show them working rather than theoretical six form debating niave policies. | Has the left a future? Possibly if it comes up with new solutions to the issues of today rather than using old failed solutions. Millions more people each year are gaining standards of living that only the elite could afford a generation ago but the left don't like to focus on the positives - hence the move to talk about inequality of wealth rather than whether standards of living are rising (you can have zero wealth but a decent standard of living). The left needs to talk about real solutions and show them working rather than theoretical six form debating niave policies. |
| Can you accept that challenge? | Can you accept that challenge? |
| 1.47pm BST | 1.47pm BST |
| 13:47 | 13:47 |
| If you are interested in the Paralympics our colleagues on the picture desk are selecting some of the best images from each day. | If you are interested in the Paralympics our colleagues on the picture desk are selecting some of the best images from each day. |
| 1.29pm BST | 1.29pm BST |
| 13:29 | 13:29 |
| Readers discuss coverage of the Paralympics | Readers discuss coverage of the Paralympics |
| Matthew Holmes | Matthew Holmes |
| Well this is going to be a depressing politically themed thread today. | Well this is going to be a depressing politically themed thread today. |
| I had a steak and Stilton pastie for lunch. Bloody marvellous. | I had a steak and Stilton pastie for lunch. Bloody marvellous. |
| You may carry on pointing out the flaws in your political opponents while overlooking the flaws in your allies. | You may carry on pointing out the flaws in your political opponents while overlooking the flaws in your allies. |
| Ok we’re listening Mark – let’s broaden things out. (Cheese and tomato sandwich for me ... ) | Ok we’re listening Mark – let’s broaden things out. (Cheese and tomato sandwich for me ... ) |
| Each week we ask our team of moderators to highlight some articles where there’s been a really thought-provoking, interesting or fun conversation. This week, we look at your reaction to a comment piece by Penny Pepper, a writer and disability rights activist who had some thoughts on the coverage of the Paralympic Games. | Each week we ask our team of moderators to highlight some articles where there’s been a really thought-provoking, interesting or fun conversation. This week, we look at your reaction to a comment piece by Penny Pepper, a writer and disability rights activist who had some thoughts on the coverage of the Paralympic Games. |
| Below are some comments they thought contributed to the debate. | Below are some comments they thought contributed to the debate. |
| ‘My kids were amazed to see what people with disabilities were able to do’ | ‘My kids were amazed to see what people with disabilities were able to do’ |
| That's an interesting perspective, but surely it is a fantastic message to send out...that a disability need not stop anyone from having dreams and that that there are other abilities that can shine in the same person? | That's an interesting perspective, but surely it is a fantastic message to send out...that a disability need not stop anyone from having dreams and that that there are other abilities that can shine in the same person? |
| I know my kids were amazed to see what people with disabilities were able to do, especially during the London Paralympics. It's difficult to teach that to a child in theory and it certainly doesn't mean that all disabled people need to live up to that expectation. | I know my kids were amazed to see what people with disabilities were able to do, especially during the London Paralympics. It's difficult to teach that to a child in theory and it certainly doesn't mean that all disabled people need to live up to that expectation. |
| Should the message not be "Rights AND Games"? No need to make them mutually exclusive. | Should the message not be "Rights AND Games"? No need to make them mutually exclusive. |
| ‘I find much of the coverage unctuous and patronising’ | ‘I find much of the coverage unctuous and patronising’ |
| I find much of the media coverage of the Paralympics unctuous and patronising. The absurd hyperbole surrounding the games makes it difficult to watch sometimes, without switching off the overblown commentary. | I find much of the media coverage of the Paralympics unctuous and patronising. The absurd hyperbole surrounding the games makes it difficult to watch sometimes, without switching off the overblown commentary. |
| ‘As someone disabled by cancer, I am so torn on this issue’ | ‘As someone disabled by cancer, I am so torn on this issue’ |
| As someone disabled by cancer, I am so torn on this issue. The Paralympics does to much to educate society about disability and imparts a really positive message, but it also leads people to be more dismissive of real physical and mental conditions that are real and do need to be taken into account. The DLA or PIP is essential for some disabled people who need extra help. Disability already saps one's confidence because you effectively cannot trust your body, or indeed other's reactions. I have been made fun of for having no hair- having no eyelashes and eyebrows makes one look strange but also abused simply for having to stop walking suddenly because I felt my legs give way and someone pushed me aside. The Job Centres need to stop bullying disabled people into work they simply cannot do or can only do on a good day, by alluding to the Olympics and "can do" attitude. | As someone disabled by cancer, I am so torn on this issue. The Paralympics does to much to educate society about disability and imparts a really positive message, but it also leads people to be more dismissive of real physical and mental conditions that are real and do need to be taken into account. The DLA or PIP is essential for some disabled people who need extra help. Disability already saps one's confidence because you effectively cannot trust your body, or indeed other's reactions. I have been made fun of for having no hair- having no eyelashes and eyebrows makes one look strange but also abused simply for having to stop walking suddenly because I felt my legs give way and someone pushed me aside. The Job Centres need to stop bullying disabled people into work they simply cannot do or can only do on a good day, by alluding to the Olympics and "can do" attitude. |
| What do you think? | What do you think? |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 1.30pm BST | at 1.30pm BST |
| 1.19pm BST | 1.19pm BST |
| 13:19 | 13:19 |
| More thoughts on the left from below the line: | More thoughts on the left from below the line: |
| The left will always have a future. Especially in a country where inequality is becoming less popular. | The left will always have a future. Especially in a country where inequality is becoming less popular. |
| However, what does this mean for Labour party? The Labour party was the party of progress of the 20th century. Great party. But ultimately, undone by the breakdown in 1970's. Wilson's voters. don;t forget, remembered the depression and world war 2. Today's baby boomers have no memory of those things, just the 1970's and 1980's. Left boomers remember 1980's as unemployment, pit closures, factory closures. The right boomers remember the property ownership, share ownership, white collar jobs. And they were in the majority. Neoliberalism, polarised, because it widened wealth gaps, and as a result, many areas became more left wing (merseyside, glasgow etc). But they were minority by geography. Most Brits liked neoliberalism and did well out of it. | However, what does this mean for Labour party? The Labour party was the party of progress of the 20th century. Great party. But ultimately, undone by the breakdown in 1970's. Wilson's voters. don;t forget, remembered the depression and world war 2. Today's baby boomers have no memory of those things, just the 1970's and 1980's. Left boomers remember 1980's as unemployment, pit closures, factory closures. The right boomers remember the property ownership, share ownership, white collar jobs. And they were in the majority. Neoliberalism, polarised, because it widened wealth gaps, and as a result, many areas became more left wing (merseyside, glasgow etc). But they were minority by geography. Most Brits liked neoliberalism and did well out of it. |
| Right wing baby boomers have such bad memories of the 1970's, that they'll insist on the economics that took us to the 1930's.Where does this leave the labour party? Divided by geography. The party became a monopolist on left politics, and like monopolistic corporations who become bad for capitalism, the Labour party at it's electoral height, 1997-2010 became bad for socialism. The future may lie with Greens, or it may lie with various community action groups. The electoral and economic geography of this country is too difficult to consolidate for labour. In effect, they have pander to and to win the votes of, people who don't give two shits about low wage workers and renters, while holding onto the votes of people who do. Can;t be done anymore, I'm afraid. | Right wing baby boomers have such bad memories of the 1970's, that they'll insist on the economics that took us to the 1930's.Where does this leave the labour party? Divided by geography. The party became a monopolist on left politics, and like monopolistic corporations who become bad for capitalism, the Labour party at it's electoral height, 1997-2010 became bad for socialism. The future may lie with Greens, or it may lie with various community action groups. The electoral and economic geography of this country is too difficult to consolidate for labour. In effect, they have pander to and to win the votes of, people who don't give two shits about low wage workers and renters, while holding onto the votes of people who do. Can;t be done anymore, I'm afraid. |
| And a response ... | And a response ... |
| Pretty good, that. | Pretty good, that. |
| Some of you have been talking about a council by-election in Sheffield yesterday. | Some of you have been talking about a council by-election in Sheffield yesterday. |
| The Mosborough (Sheffield) Byelection result, where a Labour safe seat was lost, must come as a wake-up call for all who wish Labour to thrive. | The Mosborough (Sheffield) Byelection result, where a Labour safe seat was lost, must come as a wake-up call for all who wish Labour to thrive. |
| Losing Labour candidate was Julie Grocutt from Stocksbridge, an anti-Corbyn, pro-Smith groopie, who previously also put her 2 cents in regarding the Brick-through-"Eagle's"-window incident. | Losing Labour candidate was Julie Grocutt from Stocksbridge, an anti-Corbyn, pro-Smith groopie, who previously also put her 2 cents in regarding the Brick-through-"Eagle's"-window incident. |
| Clearly, reality has just gobsmacked the claim by the rebel PLP and their right-wing handlers, that they and only they are "electable", whilst Corbyn is not.Put simply: in the UK there's two simultaneous political bottom-up revolutions going on. One by the public at large against UK membership of the EU.And one of Labour members, sympatisers AND voters, against giving Labour safe seats to Labour-in-name-only right-wing candidates.Only solution: replacing the 171 rebel, right-wing PLP members with their delusions of "electability" by really electable, left-wing candidates. In a word: deselect. | Clearly, reality has just gobsmacked the claim by the rebel PLP and their right-wing handlers, that they and only they are "electable", whilst Corbyn is not.Put simply: in the UK there's two simultaneous political bottom-up revolutions going on. One by the public at large against UK membership of the EU.And one of Labour members, sympatisers AND voters, against giving Labour safe seats to Labour-in-name-only right-wing candidates.Only solution: replacing the 171 rebel, right-wing PLP members with their delusions of "electability" by really electable, left-wing candidates. In a word: deselect. |
| I don't think many of the voters in that ward would have voted one way or another because of the factional preference of the Labour candidate. 99% of people don't care about that stuff. | I don't think many of the voters in that ward would have voted one way or another because of the factional preference of the Labour candidate. 99% of people don't care about that stuff. |
| 1.13pm BST | 1.13pm BST |
| 13:13 | 13:13 |
| Are you celebrating Star Trek's 50th birthday? | Are you celebrating Star Trek's 50th birthday? |
| Away from politics briefly – are you a Star Trek fan? If so you’ll know the show is celebrating its 50th anniversary this week – and you might be interested in our callout asking you to share your stories and photos. | Away from politics briefly – are you a Star Trek fan? If so you’ll know the show is celebrating its 50th anniversary this week – and you might be interested in our callout asking you to share your stories and photos. |
| Here’s our colleague James Walsh on what we’re looking for: | Here’s our colleague James Walsh on what we’re looking for: |
| Star Trek: The Original Series (or, as it was known then, “Star Trek”) first appeared on US television on 8 September 1966. Its utopian vision of the future was a space western stuffed with allegory, adventure and the occasional green slave woman. | Star Trek: The Original Series (or, as it was known then, “Star Trek”) first appeared on US television on 8 September 1966. Its utopian vision of the future was a space western stuffed with allegory, adventure and the occasional green slave woman. |
| Half a century on, the franchise has taken in assorted spin-off series, an animated version, 13 movies, and a collection of not very good video games. The latest Star Trek film, Star Trek: Beyond, came out this summer, and a new television series is planned for 2017. | Half a century on, the franchise has taken in assorted spin-off series, an animated version, 13 movies, and a collection of not very good video games. The latest Star Trek film, Star Trek: Beyond, came out this summer, and a new television series is planned for 2017. |
| Watching our daughter become TNG | Watching our daughter become TNG |
| This is our 10yr old Star Trek fanatic Alannah-Mae. Both her dad and I have been fans for years, this year our daughter watched the Voyager series from start to finish. She adored it - the series really resonated with her fierce independent streak; a female captain and head of engineering!! | This is our 10yr old Star Trek fanatic Alannah-Mae. Both her dad and I have been fans for years, this year our daughter watched the Voyager series from start to finish. She adored it - the series really resonated with her fierce independent streak; a female captain and head of engineering!! |
| Watching her drop into the the Star Trek world and take so much joy and inspiration from it made us live it even more. | Watching her drop into the the Star Trek world and take so much joy and inspiration from it made us live it even more. |
| This picture is her as Janeway at her first ComicCon event. | This picture is her as Janeway at her first ComicCon event. |
| Sent via Guardian Witness | Sent via Guardian Witness |
| By Emma Burgess | By Emma Burgess |
| 8 September 2016, 22:28 | 8 September 2016, 22:28 |
| We’d like to hear your Star Trek stories and see your Star Trek-related pictures – like the one Emma Burgess shared, above. Do you have any models, costumes or other assorted memorabilia? Perhaps like me you have a shelf of old Star Trek novels and a model of the USS Defiant on your window sill. Or perhaps not. | We’d like to hear your Star Trek stories and see your Star Trek-related pictures – like the one Emma Burgess shared, above. Do you have any models, costumes or other assorted memorabilia? Perhaps like me you have a shelf of old Star Trek novels and a model of the USS Defiant on your window sill. Or perhaps not. |
| You can share your stories and pictures with the blue GuardianWitness buttons on this article | You can share your stories and pictures with the blue GuardianWitness buttons on this article |
| 1.02pm BST | 1.02pm BST |
| 13:02 | 13:02 |
| John Harris is here now | John Harris is here now |
| John Harris is responding to some of your responses to his article and points here in the comments. | John Harris is responding to some of your responses to his article and points here in the comments. |
| In the face of such conscienceless greed exhibited by buy-to-let landlords and property investors (including most of the ruling elite), who see nothing wrong in direct exploitation of the rising generation through exhorbitant rents and soaring house prices, I would say that the left has a chance. If only they could find the charismatic leader to unite the various factions. JC is not that person. | In the face of such conscienceless greed exhibited by buy-to-let landlords and property investors (including most of the ruling elite), who see nothing wrong in direct exploitation of the rising generation through exhorbitant rents and soaring house prices, I would say that the left has a chance. If only they could find the charismatic leader to unite the various factions. JC is not that person. |
| It has to run deeper than that. As the piece says: | It has to run deeper than that. As the piece says: |
| Labour is engulfed by the same crisis facing its sister parties in Europe. Political commentary tends to focus on politicians, and describe the world as if parties can be pulled here and there by the sheer will of powerful individuals. But Labour’s problems are systemic, rooted in the deepest structures of the economy and society. The left’s basic ideals of equality, solidarity and a protected public realm should be ageless. But everything on which it once built its strength has either disappeared, or is shrinking fast. | Labour is engulfed by the same crisis facing its sister parties in Europe. Political commentary tends to focus on politicians, and describe the world as if parties can be pulled here and there by the sheer will of powerful individuals. But Labour’s problems are systemic, rooted in the deepest structures of the economy and society. The left’s basic ideals of equality, solidarity and a protected public realm should be ageless. But everything on which it once built its strength has either disappeared, or is shrinking fast. |
| For the Left to have a future, the following urgently need to read John Harris: JEREMY CORBYN, OWEN SMITH, CAROLINE LUCAS, that new Green co-leader who called UKIP 'fascists', and TIM FARRON. Can they come out of their comfort zones? | For the Left to have a future, the following urgently need to read John Harris: JEREMY CORBYN, OWEN SMITH, CAROLINE LUCAS, that new Green co-leader who called UKIP 'fascists', and TIM FARRON. Can they come out of their comfort zones? |
| In fairness, C.Lucas is very good on what was in that piece - UBI has been Green Party politics for ages, she's very good at working with people from other parties... has a broad but radical understanding of modern left politics. Not much of that in evidence on the Labour Question Time last night, unfort. | In fairness, C.Lucas is very good on what was in that piece - UBI has been Green Party politics for ages, she's very good at working with people from other parties... has a broad but radical understanding of modern left politics. Not much of that in evidence on the Labour Question Time last night, unfort. |
| 12.49pm BST | 12.49pm BST |
| 12:49 | 12:49 |
| You’re discussing that question of the week – here are a few of your comments so far: | You’re discussing that question of the week – here are a few of your comments so far: |
| Of course the left has a chance. | Of course the left has a chance. |
| What's the alternative - just let everything happen and slowly erode away everything that has been achieved by the left in the past, you know, funny lefty stuff like sick pay, maternity leave, weekends, holidays, social care, environmental protection etc.? | What's the alternative - just let everything happen and slowly erode away everything that has been achieved by the left in the past, you know, funny lefty stuff like sick pay, maternity leave, weekends, holidays, social care, environmental protection etc.? |
| Yeah, who needs all that as long as big business can make a fat buck? | Yeah, who needs all that as long as big business can make a fat buck? |
| England, particularly, is a conservative nation, but one that could never quite become wholly conservative, such as its devotion to the NHS. Perhaps it's now time for it to completely embrace that conservatism and see where it leads? I think it will lead to worse lives for many of us. But that appears to be what the majority of Brits want. So why fight against it? | England, particularly, is a conservative nation, but one that could never quite become wholly conservative, such as its devotion to the NHS. Perhaps it's now time for it to completely embrace that conservatism and see where it leads? I think it will lead to worse lives for many of us. But that appears to be what the majority of Brits want. So why fight against it? |
| "The break-up between social democracy and the new radical left" | "The break-up between social democracy and the new radical left" |
| Is the best thing ever to happen, if you think right wing, Free Market extremists should be left to gut, a Century of left wing advances in our Societys. Notably: in free Health care & services for the poor, elderly, disabled, or the other most vulnerable groups in society. By spiltting the left, it reduces it to powerless impotent fury: anyone who does not think the left must win elections, to stop this wilful vandalism of our societys is the problem, not the solution. | Is the best thing ever to happen, if you think right wing, Free Market extremists should be left to gut, a Century of left wing advances in our Societys. Notably: in free Health care & services for the poor, elderly, disabled, or the other most vulnerable groups in society. By spiltting the left, it reduces it to powerless impotent fury: anyone who does not think the left must win elections, to stop this wilful vandalism of our societys is the problem, not the solution. |
| The left absolutely does have a future.. but the Guardian needs to stop attacking it. | The left absolutely does have a future.. but the Guardian needs to stop attacking it. |
| What has "become" the left in recent years (identity politics > all) is now discredited and thankfully in decline. | What has "become" the left in recent years (identity politics > all) is now discredited and thankfully in decline. |
| The Guardian can either support this, or it can continue its own decline into irrelevance and bankruptcy. | The Guardian can either support this, or it can continue its own decline into irrelevance and bankruptcy. |
| Click on the comments to scroll directly to them, or get involved yourself below. | Click on the comments to scroll directly to them, or get involved yourself below. |
| 12.24pm BST | 12.24pm BST |
| 12:24 | 12:24 |
| Question of the week: what will the left look like in the future? | Question of the week: what will the left look like in the future? |
| John Harris | John Harris |
| After reading his long read this week one reader asked John Harris to expand on what he thinks the alternatives for the future left are – so where it can go now? Is Labour dead? What would a new party look like? Here is his response. | After reading his long read this week one reader asked John Harris to expand on what he thinks the alternatives for the future left are – so where it can go now? Is Labour dead? What would a new party look like? Here is his response. |
| The most basic point that arises from what my piece says is that the revival of the political left, here and across the world, is probably going to be a long haul. The break-up between social democracy and the new radical left (e.g Podemos in Spain, elements of Syriza in Greece, many of the forces behind the Bernie Sanders campaign) has only just happened. Debate and thought about how much economies have changed and what the left should do about it is still in the foothills. | The most basic point that arises from what my piece says is that the revival of the political left, here and across the world, is probably going to be a long haul. The break-up between social democracy and the new radical left (e.g Podemos in Spain, elements of Syriza in Greece, many of the forces behind the Bernie Sanders campaign) has only just happened. Debate and thought about how much economies have changed and what the left should do about it is still in the foothills. |
| If you want a sense of what a long political haul looks like, start with the historian Paul Addison’s book The Road To 1945. My stock example of what it deals with is that campaigning for universal Child Benefit began in 1917, and it arrived nearly 30 years later. The same will apply to a Universal Basic Income (or UBI), which I think has to be the core of any new left politics – given that it addresses insecurity rooted in technology, and holds out the prospect of automation being a liberating rather than a destructive force. Ditto the fight for Proportional Representation. This isn’t to say that elections in the meantime aren’t worth fighting, but that the left should be thinking strategically, and understanding what an onerous task it faces. | If you want a sense of what a long political haul looks like, start with the historian Paul Addison’s book The Road To 1945. My stock example of what it deals with is that campaigning for universal Child Benefit began in 1917, and it arrived nearly 30 years later. The same will apply to a Universal Basic Income (or UBI), which I think has to be the core of any new left politics – given that it addresses insecurity rooted in technology, and holds out the prospect of automation being a liberating rather than a destructive force. Ditto the fight for Proportional Representation. This isn’t to say that elections in the meantime aren’t worth fighting, but that the left should be thinking strategically, and understanding what an onerous task it faces. |
| As to which political forces will be involved as this goes on – who knows? Personally, I have a sense that the Labour party as we know it is probably finished. The current battle over its control will be one chapter in a series of ruptures: over time, you’ll probably see elements now seen to be hostile to each other coming together, and others falling away (for flavour of this, look at some former New Labour insiders and supporters who support UBI and PR, or the people working creditably hard for Jeremy Corbyn whose politics are a bit more forward-looking and radical than his). There will also be lots of people involved from beyond Labour, which is why I think one of the most interesting initiatives right now is the Progressive Alliance idea being pursued by Compass, which involves Labour people, Greens, Lib Dems, people from the SNP etc etc. | As to which political forces will be involved as this goes on – who knows? Personally, I have a sense that the Labour party as we know it is probably finished. The current battle over its control will be one chapter in a series of ruptures: over time, you’ll probably see elements now seen to be hostile to each other coming together, and others falling away (for flavour of this, look at some former New Labour insiders and supporters who support UBI and PR, or the people working creditably hard for Jeremy Corbyn whose politics are a bit more forward-looking and radical than his). There will also be lots of people involved from beyond Labour, which is why I think one of the most interesting initiatives right now is the Progressive Alliance idea being pursued by Compass, which involves Labour people, Greens, Lib Dems, people from the SNP etc etc. |
| This is a time when politics is changing in front of our eyes, and uncertainty rules. My own belief is that the values of equality, solidarity and a world beyond the market will endure. But what form they will take is still to become clear. | This is a time when politics is changing in front of our eyes, and uncertainty rules. My own belief is that the values of equality, solidarity and a world beyond the market will endure. But what form they will take is still to become clear. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 12.27pm BST | at 12.27pm BST |
| 12.23pm BST | 12.23pm BST |
| 12:23 | 12:23 |
| Does the left have a future? | Does the left have a future? |
| John Harris | John Harris |
| Below John Harris comments on the biggest questions that came to mind when writing his long-read on whether the left has a future. | Below John Harris comments on the biggest questions that came to mind when writing his long-read on whether the left has a future. |
| One of the biggest themes in the piece was about the changing nature of work, the roots of that change in technology, and the idea that in a world of temporary employment and the gig economy, work can’t be the main way we give people security and stability. Does that match people’s understanding of how their lives are headed? Does a word like “worker” carry much weight any more? And a final one: the most talked-about way of dealing with all this is a universal basic income, which I personally think will have to be the core of any viable left politics in the future. What do people think? | One of the biggest themes in the piece was about the changing nature of work, the roots of that change in technology, and the idea that in a world of temporary employment and the gig economy, work can’t be the main way we give people security and stability. Does that match people’s understanding of how their lives are headed? Does a word like “worker” carry much weight any more? And a final one: the most talked-about way of dealing with all this is a universal basic income, which I personally think will have to be the core of any viable left politics in the future. What do people think? |
| 12.09pm BST | 12.09pm BST |
| 12:09 | 12:09 |
| The week's most read | The week's most read |
| Sarah Marsh | Sarah Marsh |
| Everyone is going wild for Apple’s new iPhone and the fact it comes with wireless headphones. Consumers are perplexed by Apple’s new iPhone 7 AirPods because of one obvious oversight: that cord is there so they don’t get lost. | Everyone is going wild for Apple’s new iPhone and the fact it comes with wireless headphones. Consumers are perplexed by Apple’s new iPhone 7 AirPods because of one obvious oversight: that cord is there so they don’t get lost. |
| Other top pieces include the news that Fabric has lost its licence and will be shutting its doors. As well as this, there’s been interest in the fact Barack Obama cancelled a meeting after the president of the Philippines called him a “son of a whore”. Finally, there was lots of interest in news that the police were called after a school sent dozens of pupils home for wearing wrong uniform. | Other top pieces include the news that Fabric has lost its licence and will be shutting its doors. As well as this, there’s been interest in the fact Barack Obama cancelled a meeting after the president of the Philippines called him a “son of a whore”. Finally, there was lots of interest in news that the police were called after a school sent dozens of pupils home for wearing wrong uniform. |
| Tell us what you’ve been reading below the line. | Tell us what you’ve been reading below the line. |
| 11.58am BST | 11.58am BST |
| 11:58 | 11:58 |
| Welcome! | Welcome! |
| Sarah Marsh | Sarah Marsh |
| It’s time for our Friday Guardian Social – your space to discuss the week’s news and views in real time. We’ll bring you the best stories of the week, with comments from the journalists involved in reporting them, as well as some of the discussions you’ve been having around the site. | It’s time for our Friday Guardian Social – your space to discuss the week’s news and views in real time. We’ll bring you the best stories of the week, with comments from the journalists involved in reporting them, as well as some of the discussions you’ve been having around the site. |
| You can also get in touch by email via matthew.holmes@theguardian.com or sarah.marsh@theguardian.com or fill out our form at the following link if you’ve got any feedback or questions you’d like our journalists to answer. | You can also get in touch by email via matthew.holmes@theguardian.com or sarah.marsh@theguardian.com or fill out our form at the following link if you’ve got any feedback or questions you’d like our journalists to answer. |
| Updated | Updated |
| at 12.39pm BST | at 12.39pm BST |